Chine - Immobilier et industrie - Evergrande

UP, c'est sans doute de là que venaient les millions de la dernière échéance :

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2021-10-26/china-urges-evergrande-founder-to-pay-debt-with-personal-wealth?srnd=economics-vp

China Urges Evergrande’s Hui to Pay Debt With His Own Wealth

Espérons qu'il ait les poches profondes.

Le 20 octobre 2021 à 19:52:30 jurgenroelandts a écrit :
Merci pour les updates, je suivais déjà un peu l'affaire mais je vais la suivre de plus près maintenant
Encore merci

UP, point de situation

https://www.google.com/amp/s/mobile.reuters.com/article/amp/idUSKBN2HH045

Evergrande rassure en redémarrant des chantiers, et pourtant :

Evergrande said on Tuesday it has resumed work on some projects in the Pearl River Delta region and it would deliver 31 real estate projects by the end of 2021. That number will rise to 40 by the end of June 2022.

Many of Evergrande's construction projects across the country have been suspended as it was unable to pay contractors. The developer has some 1,300 real estate projects across China.

31 projets en cours d'achèvement sur 1300, ça fait écho aux 80 millions remboursés sur 300 milliards. C'est rassurant sans faire oublier que le chemin est encore long.

UP, prochaine échéance le 29/09... Demain quoi

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2021-10-28/countdown-begins-for-friday-coupon-payment-evergrande-update

The developer is due to pay a $45.17 million bond coupon originally due Sept. 29 by Friday, when a 30-day grace period expires. Evergrande last week avoided default on a larger interest payment by wiring the funds days before a Saturday deadline. It still has $19.2 billion in outstanding dollar bonds and more than $300 billion in liabilities.

Et d'où viendra la monnaie ?

https://www.caixinglobal.com/2021-10-28/hong-kong-luxury-villa-linked-to-evergrandes-hui-pledged-for-loan-101792534.html

(Hong Kong) — An associate of Hui Ka Yan, chairman of troubled China Evergrande Group, recently put up a luxury house in Hong Kong for loan collateral as the billionaire and his property empire face an escalating debt crisis.

A property on Hong Kong Island’s Black’s Link trail, known for its wealthy communities and expansive views, was pledged Oct. 19 to the local branch of China Construction Bank, documents from the city’s Land Registry showed. Market observers estimate the property’s value at HK$700 million ($90 million).

A person close to the matter said the property was pledged under pressure from Evergrande’s creditors, which demanded additional security for the company’s private equity financing. Hong Kong-traded Evergrande is struggling to repay debts amounting more than $300 billion, some of which it has defaulted on.

Et voilà, ça gratte les fonds de tiroirs, la situation reste tendue.

Le 28 octobre 2021 à 10:16:35 KheyH2O a écrit :
UP, prochaine échéance le 29/09... Demain quoi

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2021-10-28/countdown-begins-for-friday-coupon-payment-evergrande-update

The developer is due to pay a $45.17 million bond coupon originally due Sept. 29 by Friday, when a 30-day grace period expires. Evergrande last week avoided default on a larger interest payment by wiring the funds days before a Saturday deadline. It still has $19.2 billion in outstanding dollar bonds and more than $300 billion in liabilities.

Et d'où viendra la monnaie ?

https://www.caixinglobal.com/2021-10-28/hong-kong-luxury-villa-linked-to-evergrandes-hui-pledged-for-loan-101792534.html

(Hong Kong) — An associate of Hui Ka Yan, chairman of troubled China Evergrande Group, recently put up a luxury house in Hong Kong for loan collateral as the billionaire and his property empire face an escalating debt crisis.

A property on Hong Kong Island’s Black’s Link trail, known for its wealthy communities and expansive views, was pledged Oct. 19 to the local branch of China Construction Bank, documents from the city’s Land Registry showed. Market observers estimate the property’s value at HK$700 million ($90 million).

A person close to the matter said the property was pledged under pressure from Evergrande’s creditors, which demanded additional security for the company’s private equity financing. Hong Kong-traded Evergrande is struggling to repay debts amounting more than $300 billion, some of which it has defaulted on.

Et voilà, ça gratte les fonds de tiroirs, la situation reste tendue.

A quel heur demain nous allons voir le gros crack ?

Le 28 octobre 2021 à 12:27:26 :

Le 28 octobre 2021 à 10:16:35 KheyH2O a écrit :
UP, prochaine échéance le 29/09... Demain quoi

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2021-10-28/countdown-begins-for-friday-coupon-payment-evergrande-update

The developer is due to pay a $45.17 million bond coupon originally due Sept. 29 by Friday, when a 30-day grace period expires. Evergrande last week avoided default on a larger interest payment by wiring the funds days before a Saturday deadline. It still has $19.2 billion in outstanding dollar bonds and more than $300 billion in liabilities.

Et d'où viendra la monnaie ?

https://www.caixinglobal.com/2021-10-28/hong-kong-luxury-villa-linked-to-evergrandes-hui-pledged-for-loan-101792534.html

(Hong Kong) — An associate of Hui Ka Yan, chairman of troubled China Evergrande Group, recently put up a luxury house in Hong Kong for loan collateral as the billionaire and his property empire face an escalating debt crisis.

A property on Hong Kong Island’s Black’s Link trail, known for its wealthy communities and expansive views, was pledged Oct. 19 to the local branch of China Construction Bank, documents from the city’s Land Registry showed. Market observers estimate the property’s value at HK$700 million ($90 million).

A person close to the matter said the property was pledged under pressure from Evergrande’s creditors, which demanded additional security for the company’s private equity financing. Hong Kong-traded Evergrande is struggling to repay debts amounting more than $300 billion, some of which it has defaulted on.

Et voilà, ça gratte les fonds de tiroirs, la situation reste tendue.

A quel heur demain nous allons voir le gros crack ?

Je ne pense pas qu'il y aura de défaut de paiement.

Les dirigeants mettent leur argent personnel pour rembourser.

Pour connaître la date du krach , il faudrait mettre en relation le patrimoine liquide des dirigeants de l'entreprise et le montant des prochains coupons des obligations.

Le 28 octobre 2021 à 13:27:49 :
J’ai rien suivi. Alors quand est ce que la Chine s’effondre sur le plan économique ?

Des mutations profondes sont en cours et c'est remarquablement bien géré

Le 28 octobre 2021 à 10:16:35 :
UP, prochaine échéance le 29/09... Demain quoi

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2021-10-28/countdown-begins-for-friday-coupon-payment-evergrande-update

The developer is due to pay a $45.17 million bond coupon originally due Sept. 29 by Friday, when a 30-day grace period expires. Evergrande last week avoided default on a larger interest payment by wiring the funds days before a Saturday deadline. It still has $19.2 billion in outstanding dollar bonds and more than $300 billion in liabilities.

Et d'où viendra la monnaie ?

https://www.caixinglobal.com/2021-10-28/hong-kong-luxury-villa-linked-to-evergrandes-hui-pledged-for-loan-101792534.html

(Hong Kong) — An associate of Hui Ka Yan, chairman of troubled China Evergrande Group, recently put up a luxury house in Hong Kong for loan collateral as the billionaire and his property empire face an escalating debt crisis.

A property on Hong Kong Island’s Black’s Link trail, known for its wealthy communities and expansive views, was pledged Oct. 19 to the local branch of China Construction Bank, documents from the city’s Land Registry showed. Market observers estimate the property’s value at HK$700 million ($90 million).

A person close to the matter said the property was pledged under pressure from Evergrande’s creditors, which demanded additional security for the company’s private equity financing. Hong Kong-traded Evergrande is struggling to repay debts amounting more than $300 billion, some of which it has defaulted on.

Et voilà, ça gratte les fonds de tiroirs, la situation reste tendue.

Mais 29.09, c'est pas en septembre?

Enfin bon, même s'ils arrivent à rembourser cette dette, est-ce qu'ils repartiront sur des bases solides? Est-ce que sera stable?

Le 28 octobre 2021 à 13:27:49 :
J’ai rien suivi. Alors quand est ce que la Chine s’effondre sur le plan économique ?

Les banques centrales occidentales impriment pour 1 milliards de $ chaque heure

Les chinois nous imiterons pour cette fois ci. Puis tout rentrera dans l’ordre. Marchez dans Paris une heure puis marchez dans une ville Top30 de Chine

Vous comprendrez que nous sommes devenu une sorte de grand zouk où on y trouve un peu de tout

Le 28 octobre 2021 à 13:35:32 :

Le 28 octobre 2021 à 10:16:35 :
UP, prochaine échéance le 29/09... Demain quoi

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2021-10-28/countdown-begins-for-friday-coupon-payment-evergrande-update

The developer is due to pay a $45.17 million bond coupon originally due Sept. 29 by Friday, when a 30-day grace period expires. Evergrande last week avoided default on a larger interest payment by wiring the funds days before a Saturday deadline. It still has $19.2 billion in outstanding dollar bonds and more than $300 billion in liabilities.

Et d'où viendra la monnaie ?

https://www.caixinglobal.com/2021-10-28/hong-kong-luxury-villa-linked-to-evergrandes-hui-pledged-for-loan-101792534.html

(Hong Kong) — An associate of Hui Ka Yan, chairman of troubled China Evergrande Group, recently put up a luxury house in Hong Kong for loan collateral as the billionaire and his property empire face an escalating debt crisis.

A property on Hong Kong Island’s Black’s Link trail, known for its wealthy communities and expansive views, was pledged Oct. 19 to the local branch of China Construction Bank, documents from the city’s Land Registry showed. Market observers estimate the property’s value at HK$700 million ($90 million).

A person close to the matter said the property was pledged under pressure from Evergrande’s creditors, which demanded additional security for the company’s private equity financing. Hong Kong-traded Evergrande is struggling to repay debts amounting more than $300 billion, some of which it has defaulted on.

Et voilà, ça gratte les fonds de tiroirs, la situation reste tendue.

Mais 29.09, c'est pas en septembre?

Enfin bon, même s'ils arrivent à rembourser cette dette, est-ce qu'ils repartiront sur des bases solides? Est-ce que sera stable?

29/09 c'était la date de paiement initial. Avec le délai de grâce (on va dire de tolérance) de 30 jours pour le paiement des intérêts, ça nous renvoie bien au 29/10.

Donc à suivre, a priori des discussions sont en cours avec les principaux souscripteurs d'obligations

Le 28 octobre 2021 à 17:57:14 :

Le 28 octobre 2021 à 13:27:49 :
J’ai rien suivi. Alors quand est ce que la Chine s’effondre sur le plan économique ?

Les banques centrales occidentales impriment pour 1 milliards de $ chaque heure

Les chinois nous imiterons pour cette fois ci. Puis tout rentrera dans l’ordre. Marchez dans Paris une heure puis marchez dans une ville Top30 de Chine

Vous comprendrez que nous sommes devenu une sorte de grand zouk où on y trouve un peu de tout

Déjà commencé, avec pour conséquence une dévaluation de leur monnaie. Pas forcément une bonne idée quand tu payes tes matières premières en dollars

A priori toujours pas de paiement, ça doit être le gros vide grenier chez le top management Evergrande pour trouver la thune

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2021-10-28/countdown-begins-for-friday-coupon-payment-evergrande-update?utm_source=google&utm_medium=bd&cmpId=google

Focus is turning to whether China Evergrande Group will stave off default again this week, as creditors prepare to negotiate a debt restructuring that would rank among the largest ever in China.

Ah et la société Kaisa rejoint le club des promoteurs dans les ennuis de trésorerie.

Et encore un défaut évité de justesse au dernier moment.

https://news.bloomberglaw.com/bankruptcy-law/evergrande-makes-overdue-interest-payment-on-second-dollar-bond

Holders of another China Evergrande Group bond received an overdue interest payment within the grace period for such transactions, according to people with knowledge of the situation, the second time this month that the troubled developer staved off a default.

Certain holders of the 9.5% U.S. dollar-denominated note maturing in 2024 received notification that they had been paid on Thursday, said the people, who asked not to be identified discussing private payments. Evergrande skipped an interest payment due Sept. 29, starting the clock on a 30-day grace period before investors could declare a default.

Ça va continuer tant que les fondateurs de l'entreprise pourront mettre leurs biens personnels pour payer les intérêts, mais ils n'ont sans doute pas 300 milliards $ pour la totalité de l'ardoise.

A suivre donc.

Et pendant ce temps là le problème se propage :

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2021-10-28/kaisa-shares-plunge-to-record-low-on-credit-rating-downgrades

Kaisa Group Holdings Ltd. shares plunged a record 18% in Hong Kong after two credit assessors downgraded the Shenzhen-based developer and said it may struggle to refinance dollar debt. The company’s 6.5% bond due Dec. 7 fell 5.9 cents to 52.1 cents on the dollar, poised for a record low, amid a broad selloff in debt issued by Chinese developers.

Le 28 octobre 2021 à 19:11:15 :

Le 28 octobre 2021 à 13:35:32 :

Le 28 octobre 2021 à 10:16:35 :
UP, prochaine échéance le 29/09... Demain quoi

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2021-10-28/countdown-begins-for-friday-coupon-payment-evergrande-update

The developer is due to pay a $45.17 million bond coupon originally due Sept. 29 by Friday, when a 30-day grace period expires. Evergrande last week avoided default on a larger interest payment by wiring the funds days before a Saturday deadline. It still has $19.2 billion in outstanding dollar bonds and more than $300 billion in liabilities.

Et d'où viendra la monnaie ?

https://www.caixinglobal.com/2021-10-28/hong-kong-luxury-villa-linked-to-evergrandes-hui-pledged-for-loan-101792534.html

(Hong Kong) — An associate of Hui Ka Yan, chairman of troubled China Evergrande Group, recently put up a luxury house in Hong Kong for loan collateral as the billionaire and his property empire face an escalating debt crisis.

A property on Hong Kong Island’s Black’s Link trail, known for its wealthy communities and expansive views, was pledged Oct. 19 to the local branch of China Construction Bank, documents from the city’s Land Registry showed. Market observers estimate the property’s value at HK$700 million ($90 million).

A person close to the matter said the property was pledged under pressure from Evergrande’s creditors, which demanded additional security for the company’s private equity financing. Hong Kong-traded Evergrande is struggling to repay debts amounting more than $300 billion, some of which it has defaulted on.

Et voilà, ça gratte les fonds de tiroirs, la situation reste tendue.

Mais 29.09, c'est pas en septembre?

Enfin bon, même s'ils arrivent à rembourser cette dette, est-ce qu'ils repartiront sur des bases solides? Est-ce que sera stable?

29/09 c'était la date de paiement initial. Avec le délai de grâce (on va dire de tolérance) de 30 jours pour le paiement des intérêts, ça nous renvoie bien au 29/10.

Donc à suivre, a priori des discussions sont en cours avec les principaux souscripteurs d'obligations

Ah d'accord, merci pour les clarifications

Le 29 octobre 2021 à 09:29:47 :
Ouai donc en gros pour le moment ils mettent des pansements mais ça ne stoppe pas l'hémorragie. Ils gagnent du temps, à savoir si ça leur sera bénéfique au final ou si ça ne changera rien.

Ils vont tous payer de leur poche, ce qui permettra de flotter un instant, puis quand ils seront ruinés là ça va couler

En plus Evergrande ne sont pas les seuls à avoir ce genre de problèmes on dirait